Episode 29 · Patrick Cleary · January 27, 2024
Patrick Cleary came to Humboldt after a long stretch in New York banking and a midlife reset that sent him looking for a different kind of life. What followed was a run through local media, community work, and music: helping steady KHUM, launching the Lost Coast Outpost, leading the Humboldt Area Foundation, and staying close to Folklife and Humboldt’s music scene. It’s a conversation about how someone from somewhere else can still end up helping shape the place they landed.
Watch the conversation
What this episode covers
- Leaving Wall Street after divorce, burnout, and a search for a different way to live.
- Finding Humboldt through a map, a tip from a friend, and a house in Big Lagoon.
- Early work here, from learning guitar to stepping in at the co-op during a rough patch.
- Helping build and protect KHUM, KSLG, and the local radio ecosystem.
- The origin of the Lost Coast Outpost and why local news still matters here.
- Work with the Humboldt Area Foundation and the Humboldt Folklife Society, including music, education, and community funding.
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Transcript
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Scott Hammond: Hey, welcome my friend, Patrick Cleary.
Patrick Cleary: Hey, Scott.
Scott Hammond: 100% Humboldt, and you, you are all of that and then some.
Patrick Cleary: [laughs] I don't know about that. Some people might disagree.
I wasn't born here.
Scott Hammond: That's okay.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: But you're local enough. I mean, eh, you know, Ferndale, y- I mean,
there 200 years, don't you?
Patrick Cleary: Oh, yeah, I mean-
Scott Hammond: Before you're really local.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, I mean-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … I'm, I'm not gonna g- I'm not gonna say anything on the-
Scott Hammond: Yeah, don't say the-
Patrick Cleary: … on the record a-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … none of that.
Scott Hammond: Don't say that. We love you, Ferndale.
Patrick Cleary: Yes. Exactly.
Scott Hammond: Uh, thanks for coming. Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: My f- my friend called me an archivist of,
like that, so that's part of our mission, and you seem to be the perfect guy. So how, how did Patrick Cleary get, get to Humboldt? W- tell us about your journey.
Patrick Cleary: Well, um, you know, there was a map,
Point.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: And I just-
Scott Hammond: It's right here.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. So if I… I decided if I was going to,
uh, find a sign from the universe about where
it.
Scott Hammond: Wow. How did… Wait. How did you learn about Patrick's Point?
Just saw it on a map?
Patrick Cleary: Okay. So, uh, slightly longer story.
Um, I was living in New York City, working on Wall Street, having my, uh, somewhat premature midlife crisis-
Scott Hammond: [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: … um, and decided that it was, you know, time to,
um, sort of move and, um, start over
and-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … um, figure out what I wanted to do.
And, um, there were, there were a number of factors, but there was, Jennifer Mackey, who, um, uh, at the time was living here in Humboldt.
Scott Hammond: Mm.
Patrick Cleary: And she, um, suggested that I might wanna check it out,
sending me, you know, things like 101 Things to Do in Humboldt
Scott Hammond: Sure.
Patrick Cleary: And all-
Scott Hammond: Greg's magazine. Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Exactly. I don't know if Greg owned it back then, but-
Scott Hammond: No, probably didn't.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Um,
and, um, yeah, I saw a thing on the map called Patrick's
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … I said, you know, "Maybe I should check that out."
Scott Hammond: Wow. Did you go to Patrick's Point then
Patrick Cleary: Um, w-
Scott Hammond: To camp out?
Patrick Cleary: My, my then wife and I, um, put our stuff in storage
and dr-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … drove across the country, checking out different places.
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: Wound up here. Um, and within a week
of being here, found a house to rent up in Big Lagoon,
Point.
Scott Hammond: Right.
Patrick Cleary: And after about two months here, the guy who owned the house told me
that I belonged here, and so he was gonna sell me the house.
Scott Hammond: Whoa.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and-
Scott Hammond: Did you buy it?
Patrick Cleary: I did. I did.
Scott Hammond: When… I bet that was real expensive back in that day.
Patrick Cleary: [laughs] 90, 1997.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. Yeah, but yeah, boy, Big Lagoon's pretty up there.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. It's beautiful.
Scott Hammond: So you were… If, if I remember in talking to you in the
investment banker or in banking then?
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. I, I, um, I came straight out of college up to, uh,
little country bank called Chase Manhattan.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, went through their training program,
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, did that for eight years. Um-
Scott Hammond: Wow
Patrick Cleary: … went to a firm called Trust Company of the
what they now call private equity.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and us- so investing money in private businesses.
Scott Hammond: Wow.
Patrick Cleary: And then went back to Chase and did a couple years of
international investment banking.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, primarily in the, um, telecommunications and media business.
Scott Hammond: Was this still New York City?
Patrick Cleary: Yes.
Scott Hammond: Mm.
Patrick Cleary: Still New York City. Though that particular stint, I
um, about 75% of the time.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. No life.
Patrick Cleary: Um, you know, I was in, uh… I mean, I got to see parts of the world.
I got to see Indonesia and Singapore-
Scott Hammond: Wow
Patrick Cleary: … and Iceland and London and, uh, you know, a-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … a number of-
Scott Hammond: From the airport? Or f- [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: Uh, yeah. From-
Scott Hammond: Can I- [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: … a- and the Hyatt Hotel, which are-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … you know, um-
Scott Hammond: Got to see some
Patrick Cleary: … are, are remarkably similar th-
Scott Hammond: Right.
Patrick Cleary: Or throughout the world.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. Yeah. Where'd you go to college?
Patrick Cleary: Uh, Georgetown.
Scott Hammond: Okay.
Patrick Cleary: Washington, DC.
Scott Hammond: In DC.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Huh. Finance major?
Patrick Cleary: Uh, international finance, yeah.
Scott Hammond: Wow, okay.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: And then, uh, d- nor- naturally to New York City to banking,
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, there was, um, there were like, I think,
up-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … in the training program at Chase, so.
Scott Hammond: Let, let me press on this for a second.
So why, why, why did you decide to come to Humboldt and, uh, put, put all your crap in storage and, I mean, what… Was there something that precipitated that? Uh, you said midlife crisis.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Just-
Patrick Cleary: I mean-
Scott Hammond: … had enough of this. I wanna go try something new.
Patrick Cleary: Well, I mean, uh, it was a variety of things.
It was, um, I had been through my first divorce, and-
Scott Hammond: Mm
Patrick Cleary: … that was, um,
very, um, traumatic to me.
Scott Hammond: Sure.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … I, I never expected to be the type of person
Scott Hammond: Right.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and, um, I, and I was unhappy.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
um, I was, you know… A- and I was kinda, like, w- waking up. I was one of those things where, um, I did really well when I got to Wall Street. You know, I, I, I went to Wall Street, I was 21 years old.
Scott Hammond: Wow.
Patrick Cleary: Um, I was a vi-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … I was a vice president at Chase by the
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: Um, you know, I kept getting promoted.
I never even g- got around to going to business school
Scott Hammond: Getting promoted
Patrick Cleary: … uh, promoted and everything.
Scott Hammond: [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: Um, and then-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … you know, with the divorce, um,
really forced me to say, "What am I doing with my life?"
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: And, um-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … and started doing some, uh, particularly, um, uh,
Outward Bound trips.
Scott Hammond: Mm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, as part… You know, I don't, um, know how m-
familiar you are with Outward Bound, but Outward Bound is primarily an
program.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, mostly for youth, but they, um-
Scott Hammond: It's outdoor, though. It's outdoor, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: It, it's outdoor. It's e- experiential, uh, education.
Scott Hammond: Love it, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: And, um, and on one of those trips,
Scott Hammond: Mm
Patrick Cleary: … became friends, and-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … I was going through my soul-searching and-
Scott Hammond: Nice. Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … um, but, uh, it was time to leave. It
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
you know, I, I… My thinking straight out of college was, go to New York City for a couple-
Scott Hammond: Mm
Patrick Cleary: … years. That'll be fun."
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: And there I was 17 years later.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, right. [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: [laughs] You know, a- as ti-
Scott Hammond: Right
Patrick Cleary: … as time happens, like to us.
Scott Hammond: Right. Yeah. And on the map, New York City is, like-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Uh-
Scott Hammond: … seven walls that way, the other side of the studio.
Patrick Cleary: Maybe, maybe a few-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … more-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … on that sort of scale, yeah.
Scott Hammond: Ah. And, and, and a, and a-A dimension away in some ways-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … in terms of-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … culture and-
Patrick Cleary: I, I, I tell people I tried to move as far away
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … as, as possible and still stay in the continental United
Scott Hammond: Funny story. A lot of people, I think Mary Keen first got this,
people came as far west as they could and le- landed in Humboldt. Wound up here for a variety of reasons, and, uh, there's, you know, nowhere else to go.
[laughs]
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. There were also a lot of people go north-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … from, in the… They wanna stay in California-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … but they wanna get as far away from
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … as possible, so.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. And you can't… I don't…
not much out in Fort Bragg.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. I mean, um,
Mendocino could've been possible.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: You know, um,
at the time, I, you know, when I did this, I, um, I had a map of the United States and just crossed off where I did not wanna live.
Scott Hammond: [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: You know, and, uh, and had a list of things that I
wanted in a community.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, and, you know, there were certain things like a university.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: I, I really wanted to live in a place
I wanted a place that had an airport so I could get-
Scott Hammond: Sure
Patrick Cleary: … out of there if I had to.
Scott Hammond: Maybe some, some music.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, s- yeah.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and, uh, water.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: You know, I wanted to be, you know, somewhere-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … near the water. Um,
and, um, th- this kinda fit.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. Sounds good. So what did you do after you arrived,
plugged into, say, the rad- radio world and…
Patrick Cleary: Well, I, um,
I really spent the first, um, couple years trying to learn to play the guitar.
Scott Hammond: Oh, wow.
Patrick Cleary: I mean, that was really-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … my primary focus. And I had a couple clients that I
kept from my Wall Street days-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … you know, for a short period of time.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and, um, got involved a little bit, um, uh, through Humboldt Area Foundation with the, uh, development of the prosperity strategy, strategy that they did in l- you know, the late '90s, early
2000s.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, so I met some people there.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and then really the first,
you know, real job I had since I-
Scott Hammond: [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: … when I moved here. Uh, and I, you know, I'd been lucky.
I'd saved some money from-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … uh, working in New York. Um,
um, first job I had was, uh, running the co-op.
Um-
Scott Hammond: Okay.
Patrick Cleary: They had, um,
um… You, you might recall somewhere around 2000, 2001, they did the remodel of the Arcata store.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and that went
dramatically over budget. Um-
Scott Hammond: Right. I remember that, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: And they got into some financial trouble, and-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … um, and the employees were angry because they had been living
jackhammers and dust and everything-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … and
were promised, um, all sorts of things when the remodel And, um, they finished the remodel, and the ma-
Scott Hammond: They were broke. Broke
Patrick Cleary: … and the, and the management said,
broke."
Scott Hammond: Wow. Wow.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and so the employees responded and said,
a union."
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and, um, so the board had a meeting, and somebody said, "You know, I, I think we need a Wall Street guy to come in here and try to straighten us out."
Scott Hammond: Wow.
Patrick Cleary: And a f- friend of mine was at the meeting and says, "You know,
Scott Hammond: Do you know a guy?
Patrick Cleary: [laughs] I may know a guy.
Scott Hammond: He's up in Big Lagoon.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Um, so I, um, I came in as the
interim general manager-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … of the co-op and did that for about a year and a half.
Scott Hammond: I think I remember that, yeah. So who…
The outgoing, and then you ca- Are they still a union shop?
Patrick Cleary: Oh, yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Very much so.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. Yeah. We go to-
Patrick Cleary: I-
Scott Hammond: … church right across the street,
Patrick Cleary: Oh, uh, the, the-
Scott Hammond: They're, they're great
Patrick Cleary: … Catalyst? Yeah.
Scott Hammond: The, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: They do a good job.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you know, the, um-
Scott Hammond: And so does the co-op.
Patrick Cleary: [laughs] Well, I, I love Bethany and Jason.
Scott Hammond: Oh, they're great.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: Had her on the show. She's great.
Patrick Cleary: Oh, good.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Good. Um,
yeah, I mean, y- I think the, um… When I got to the co-op, the, um, turnover rate was 83% a year.
Scott Hammond: Jeez. Really? Wow.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: So it was a job training mill.
Patrick Cleary: Well, it was, uh, yeah, I mean-
Scott Hammond: Churn it.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, yeah. I don't even know that we had time to ch-
turnover.
Scott Hammond: That's a lot of turnover.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. And the union has brought a lot more
I mean, there's people who-
Scott Hammond: Sure.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. I mean, there's still a couple people there who
Not too many at this point.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: You know, maybe a dozen.
Scott Hammond: Huh. How about that?
Patrick Cleary: Um, but, um-
Scott Hammond: Well, David Lipman, our friend, was GM-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … after, well after you, but-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, um, yeah, David. I, you know, and I used to have a,
um, sort of a ritual where they would, uh, hire a new GM, and I would take him to lunch, and I would say-
Scott Hammond: Oh, how about that?
Patrick Cleary: … you know, like, "Hey, um, here, h- here's my, you know, two cents
of advice, you know?"
Uh, but-
Scott Hammond: Keep the change.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: But, uh, I, I have not met the current GM.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: But I have-
Scott Hammond: They seem to be doing a good job.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: And then, then Eureka c- what was Eureka built as, so-
Patrick Cleary: Well, Eureka-
Scott Hammond: … the two big co-ops
Patrick Cleary: … at that point was, um, the, um,
uh, Fifth and L market over by-
Scott Hammond: Right
Patrick Cleary: … Eureka City Hall.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: It was a very different store in those days.
And-
Scott Hammond: Small, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. And then it was after,
uh, when we recruited Len Mayer to come in as-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … um, GM, then Len was the one who built the, um,
store.
Scott Hammond: Which is a gorgeous store.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Really.
Patrick Cleary: It is.
Scott Hammond: They do a good job.
Patrick Cleary: Mm-hmm.
Scott Hammond: They have some African peanut soup that's super hot.
So I sat with a friend there, and he's eating their soup,
sweat, so-
Patrick Cleary: [laughs]
Scott Hammond: … if you… Watch out for the African peanut soup.
Patrick Cleary: I'll have to try it.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. I, I'm kinda looking forward to it. So,
A- after that, there's some radio s-
Patrick Cleary: Well, so during that timeframe, um, I, um,
uh, you know, I was getting into… Well, I've always been into music, but, uh, I really enjoyed this radio station,
KHUM.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, I just loved their music and, um,
involved there. And, um-And KHUM was a sort of an interesting story. It was started by, um, Cliff and Amy Berkowitz and Jacqueline Devitz.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: And, uh, in '95, um,
they started the radio station with basically no money.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: For all intents-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … and purposes. They were… They had no money.
Scott Hammond: Right.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and it was a startup.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, so it, it didn't go well.
Um, and they, um,
um, um, you know, so they were in some financial pain, but it, it-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … at the same time, they had miraculously, uh, gotten
another license-
Scott Hammond: Oh
Patrick Cleary: … for another station.
Scott Hammond: Oh.
Patrick Cleary: And so the, um, they were looking for people to put up
some money to, uh, help them build the second station-
Scott Hammond: Mm
Patrick Cleary: … ah, take care of some of the creditors
Uh, and the idea was that, um, you know, having an economy of scale operating two stations out of the same facility is,
um-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … definitely economically more viable.
And that-
Scott Hammond: Were they in Ferndale at the time?
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Okay.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Ferndale, they were in Ferndale because Ferndale
north as the FCC would allow KHUM to be at that point in time.
Scott Hammond: How about that? Let me show you Ferndale on the map.
Fortuna, Ferndale, right there.
Patrick Cleary: Right there.
Scott Hammond: The other river valley.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Can you, can you find Garberville?
Scott Hammond: Garberville's way down at the bottom of the river.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. So in tho-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … in those days KHUM was a Garberville station.
Scott Hammond: Oh, how about that? Oh, yeah, I think I remember that.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um, it's no longer licensed to Garberville,
At that time it-
Scott Hammond: How about that?
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. So, um, so the, uh, uh, signal was on
Garberville-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … and you have to have your office within-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … a place that, um, you know, can hear the station.
Scott Hammond: Okay.
Patrick Cleary: And so, uh, they were in-
Scott Hammond: And, and the signal, does it travel to Garberville?
Patrick Cleary: Uh-
Scott Hammond: Now, or does, or did it then?
Patrick Cleary: It gets down there. It, it's not as strong as it used to be down-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … in southern Humboldt.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um, it's transmitting now off of Neyland.
Scott Hammond: So these guys are kinda hurting financially a bit-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … and you come in and, and you got some expertise.
Patrick Cleary: Well, I came in as an investor.
Scott Hammond: Uh-huh.
Patrick Cleary: I put in a little bit of money. Um, I went on the board of
directors-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … and we got KSLG, um, was what the se- second station became-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … uh, launched, and, and I retired from the co-op
and, um-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: … got, got a, got a call the day before Christmas from
said, um, uh, "We bounced our payroll."
Scott Hammond: Oh, no. [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: And I said, "Uh, so how did that happen?" He said, "Well,
I said, "No, I got… I figured that much out."
Scott Hammond: Yes. [laughs] Got that part.
Patrick Cleary: [laughs]
Scott Hammond: We understand that.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Um, "How, how did we run out of money?" And he says,
I said-
Scott Hammond: Oh
Patrick Cleary: … "Oh, I don't like that answer."
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: So I went down, uh, to take a look at the books, and it
was much worse than anybody-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … was telling me.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: Don't worry, it'll get worse.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: Um, and so I, you know, debated it,
and I, you know, I was, again, very, very much in love with KHUM and what it was, I mean, not only for the music, but for-
Scott Hammond: [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: … its community involvement.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, I mean, KHUM is a, a very, very special radio
station.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and so after thinking about it, I, I went to the board and said, "Okay,
um, you, you know, we either file bankruptcy
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: "Um, I'm willing to come up with some money,
I have two conditions, and the first one is shareholder interest in it."
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: "Uh, and the second of which is we get a new general manager."
Scott Hammond: Hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and they said, "Well, who do you have in mind for general
Scott Hammond: [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: And I said, "I don't have any good ideas,
Scott Hammond: Nice.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and so I became general manager in January
2003, um, and president of the board and, um-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … and I've been pre- president of the company since then.
Um, you know, I've, uh, hired general managers over the years.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, uh, you've probably met most of them.
Scott Hammond: Many, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Sure.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and, um,
and in the meantime in 2005, uh, we made a partnership with the Blue Lake Rancheria.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, they put up some money and we bought a station
in Fortuna that had been, uh, known as The Party.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: Remember that.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. And, uh, they were,
they were broke, and so we bought that and basically rebranded as The Point.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, so that became our classic rock station.
Scott Hammond: Great station, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and then we, um,
in 2010, uh, bought the old
KXGO.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, which for
a whole variety of reasons we won't go into now, no longer exists-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … at least in its, in that incarnation.
I'm not sure that was a good thing, but-
Scott Hammond: What are the call signs? What's the calls on that now?
Patrick Cleary: Well, um, well, right now it's The Lounge.
It's 94.1, The Lounge.
Scott Hammond: It's not KXGO or…?
Patrick Cleary: No. There, there is a KXGO that Mad River Radio has,
much weaker signal than it used to be.
Scott Hammond: Whole different deal, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and then in 2011, um-
Scott Hammond: 'Cause KXGO, let me interrupt real quick,
I go way back to when it was in all the dentists'
Patrick Cleary: Oh, wow, before it became classic rock?
Scott Hammond: Before it was the monster of-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … classic rock.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. Oh, it was…
And its numbers were really good 'cause they were ev- in every office.
[laughs]
Patrick Cleary: [laughs]
Scott Hammond: Every office in Humboldt had this radio station on.
Patrick Cleary: Well, the, the, The Lounge is, you know,
Scott Hammond: Uh-huh.
Patrick Cleary: I don't know.
Scott Hammond: Okay. [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: But, uh… Though, uh, uh, The Lounge is not quite…
It, it's, um, much more upbeat and, um, it, it's far-A far cry from the old elevator music sort of style of-
Scott Hammond: Darn Amici or somebody.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. They, um-
Scott Hammond: Um
Patrick Cleary: … we're, we're, we're now more into Pink Martini and
Scott Hammond: Sure, sure.
Patrick Cleary: Chamber-
Scott Hammond: They're com- they're coming to The Brit, by the way.
Patrick Cleary: I, I saw Molly Tuttle and Infinite-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … String Dusters, uh-
Scott Hammond: That'll be, be a pretty good show
Patrick Cleary: … the Dead South.
Scott Hammond: Yep. De- uh, Jason Mraz, he's coming.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: They already re- you know, they rarely announce a bunch of shows.
So The Brit Festival is way up here in-
Patrick Cleary: Way up there, yes
Scott Hammond: … it's up there in the curtain area for, uh,
I-
Patrick Cleary: Yes
Scott Hammond: … talking to the camera. The, um…
tell us, why is KHUM special? What, what made, makes and made it special in terms of… [clears throat] Format's interesting, right? Uh, the involvement in the community. It, it's k- it's kind of a, an outlier in, in the best sense of the word. It's not, it's not, uh, uh, you know, one of the clear channel chan- you know, station. It's, it's-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … real organic, right?
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, I mean, I, I think what happened in the radio world
starting in '95 and '96, and I saw this, uh, you know, towards the tail end of my Wall Street career.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, the FCC allowed, you know, companies to own a lot more stations.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: And, uh, what happened was they
started, uh, automating and formatizing their stations, where stations started sounding the same-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … all around the country.
Scott Hammond: Oh, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and KHUM,
you know, sort of, um, you know, eschewed the, uh, idea of a format, you know, as the original radio without the rules.
Scott Hammond: Right, right.
Patrick Cleary: Um, so, you know, you could play,
um, Frank Sinatra followed by Frank Zappa.
Scott Hammond: Right.
Patrick Cleary: Um, you know.
Scott Hammond: That's fine.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: I mean, uh, you know, um,
but the, the main thing was that it was very much involved in community activities. It, it did as, and still does, the Stop the Violence campaign-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … uh, to, uh, promote awareness of issues-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … around violence in our community-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … uh, and s- starting the healing.
Um, it did a lot of, um, live broadcasts from various places.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and it had an exceptional group of people. I mean, Cliff Berkowitz, who started it, uh-
Scott Hammond: Great guy, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. And, um, you know, really-
Scott Hammond: Amy
Patrick Cleary: … Amy.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, Mike Dronkers in those days.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, Larry Trask, um, who's now runs the lounge for us.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, Larry was the first guy I hired
Scott Hammond: How about that?
Patrick Cleary: Uh, yeah, he- Larry's done almost every job-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … in the company except for sales.
Scott Hammond: Uh. [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: And that's coming, Larry.
Patrick Cleary: [laughs]
Scott Hammond: [laughs] You're, you're-
Patrick Cleary: Don't say that, he might quit on me
Scott Hammond: … you're next. [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: You know, yeah, like, you know.
Uh, no, Lar- Larry's the, um, guy who's, um, helping me with the, uh, moving the facilities into Eureka. Right.
Scott Hammond: So tell us about that. Where, where, where are you going to Eureka?
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, so we've signed a lease, uh, with the, um, support of the, uh,
Blue Lake Rancheria.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, Blue Lake Rancheria and I have a, uh, agreement and principle
that they will acquire 100% ownership of the company.
Scott Hammond: Wow.
Patrick Cleary: Um, which I'm very thrilled about-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … because I'm a big believer in local media.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and the Rancheria can't move.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: It has to stay here.
Scott Hammond: It's here.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: So, so, um, you know, we, we can, you know, sort of
ensure that we have local media-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … here. Um, you know, as I started to say, we created
the Lost Coast Outpost in 2011.
Scott Hammond: All right.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and that gave us, um, you know, an, a built-in news department.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, but the outpost has been in Eureka for the
I don't know, six, seven years maybe.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and so, um, so the, the two
sides of the company have, you know, been separate.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: And we wanna get them back even-
Scott Hammond: Together, yeah
Patrick Cleary: … together. So, uh, so we're gonna be moving into the Carson
building, the old, um, sort of, uh, downstairs theater
space-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … in the center of the building.
Scott Hammond: Does Rancheria have any part of that, or do, do…
Are they part of the, uh-
Patrick Cleary: No, the building's owned by the Northern
Scott Hammond: That's a separate entity.
Patrick Cleary: It's a nonprofit that is, um, works in
Native, uh, areas on Native issues.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: Beautiful building though. The re- remodels gorgeous.
Patrick Cleary: Well, the… Yeah. I, I, I should give you the tour sometime.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, let's do it.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: I'd like that. It was a theater back in the day, right?
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. William Carson built it as a theater in,
1890s. Um, it was a recession. He didn't wanna lay off his workers.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: And so he built an opera house.
Scott Hammond: Wow.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: And it's kind of inside, up and inside the building.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Well, I mean, he, you know, he, uh… Carson
He, um, you know, he had a department store on the ground
Scott Hammond: Uh-huh.
Patrick Cleary: He had offices-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … on the outside of the,
the theater.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, and then he had a theater on the inside.
And, um-
Scott Hammond: He's got a nice little house up the street.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: So it wa- it was walking distance.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. [laughs] He could walk to work.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: Um, you know, so it was a beautiful, beautiful building
disrepair, and, um-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … and the, uh, Northern California Indian Development
together a pretty remarkable, uh, financing package, which, um, later when we get to, uh, Humboldt Area Foundation-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … I was part of the-
Scott Hammond: Sure
Patrick Cleary: … group that, um,
helped fu- fund that.
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and so it's, um, [clears throat] you know, it's kind of right in the heart of
Old Town.
Scott Hammond: It, it is, it is the heart, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. And, you know, if you wanna-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … think about downtown revitalization,
to make sure that the, the buildings in, you know, i- in that area are, you know, robust, you know, that they're, they're not run down.
Scott Hammond: Right. Right.
Patrick Cleary: And so, uh, it's been-
Scott Hammond: And that's a big one that would be in jeopardy if it
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Well, I mean, you know, they,
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … uh, with it and, you know-And it was not seismically okay.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um, so that, you know, the seismic retrofit on that is
just really impressive-
Scott Hammond: Wow
Patrick Cleary: … when you see some of the steel beams.
Scott Hammond: We walked by it for… It seemed like they were never done.
They kept working on it for-
Patrick Cleary: Oh, yeah
Scott Hammond: … forever.
Patrick Cleary: I think it was $17 million project.
Scott Hammond: That's great. Yeah, no, what a great thing to have.
And-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … and what a great location for y'all.
Patrick Cleary: Well, I mean, yeah, it's nice. It's central.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and it's, um, it's got nice
spaces-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … um, you know, for studios-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … for the Outpost-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … um, for the salespeople to come and go, and-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … um,
and for live musicians-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … to, um, you know, come down. Uh, you know, back to the-
Scott Hammond: Ah
Patrick Cleary: … back to what makes KHUM special.
I mean, I think with the other thing that always made KHUM special was, um, they would bring live musicians in the studios.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: And there would be sort of that live performance element.
Scott Hammond: Right.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: The troubadours that are coming through town or-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … just people.
Patrick Cleary: As well as locals.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: You know, um, you know, KHUM's always, uh, been a big supporter of
local music.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: And, you know, as you and I have talked over-
Scott Hammond: Sure
Patrick Cleary: … the years, um, we have a very, very robust local
music scene.
Scott Hammond: Oh, boy, yeah. I talked to DeMark a couple weeks ago.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, I, I, I watched that one.
Scott Hammond: Oh, did you?
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: He's, he was brilliant. I thought he did a great job.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: The, um,
gosh, you know, it, it occurs to me you're like this builder and helped the co-op, and now you revitalized this radio station and build on it and, and then Loco. And let's talk about Loco. A lot of people affectionately… Lost Coast Outpost is affectionately called…
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Well, well, in fact, I'll tell… So I'll tell you the story.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: And I'll tell you.
Scott Hammond: A lot of people don't, might not know what it is.
I think it's-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. I, I, I don't know. Our, our…
The, the Google Analytics numbers that we see-
Scott Hammond: They're pretty high, right?
Patrick Cleary: Um,
i- I mean, we get 330,000 unique visitors a month. Uh, there's only a, like 120,000-
Scott Hammond: In the whole county
Patrick Cleary: … adults in the county. Now,
I'm a unique vi- visitor on my phone versus on my l- um, iPad versus on my, uh, desktop, so.
Scott Hammond: Still. But yeah.
Patrick Cleary: So divide the number by three.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. Still big numbers.
Patrick Cleary: I mean, I think 90% of Humboldt County knows what
Scott Hammond: Right
Patrick Cleary: … is. But, um, so
but it, it's, you know, it's an online newspaper.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and what the story was that, um, Hank
Sims, um, who w- at the time was the editor of the North
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … had, um,
run into, um, you know, some conflict with the publisher,
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, Judy brought an editor in above Hank-
Scott Hammond: Hmm
Patrick Cleary: … um, sort of demoting him.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: And
Hank quit, and he called me up and, um, said, "Meet me at the Double A Bar and Grill tonight."
Scott Hammond: [laughs] Which is right over here.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, right, yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, it's right there on Eureka.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, uh, right across from the courthouse,
the Double A."
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: And he said, "All the better."
Scott Hammond: Good.
Patrick Cleary: I said, "Let's go… Let's meet there."
Scott Hammond: Steak.
Patrick Cleary: And, um,
and, um, and so I get there and I say, "So Hank, what's up?" And he says, "I'm coming to work for you."
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: And I said,
"I, I, I can't afford you, Hank."
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: And he said, "Let's not let that get in the way.
Let's just let-"
Scott Hammond: Nice
Patrick Cleary: … you know, like-
Scott Hammond: Now who's in sales? [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: [laughs] Hank. A- and I'm like, uh, "Well, Hank,
do, um, with you?"
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: You know? And,
and it, it happened to be the same month that, um, America Online had paid $300 million for the Huffington Post-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: …
which got my attention. A- and, you know, I, I was reading-
Scott Hammond: Which is an online newspaper
Patrick Cleary: … which is an online newspaper.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: You know, uh… And, and, you know, and at that point I was like,
"Wait, what is the Huffington Post?"
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: I mean, it's just a website.
Scott Hammond: Right.
Patrick Cleary: $300 million for a website, huh. And I'd been
trying to study the internet. I knew that the world was changing.
I knew radio needed to adapt to it, though, um, you know, online radio listening has still never really taken off as a thing. I mean, there's so many options there.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and so I was like, you know, "Okay, Hank, let's, um,
let's keep talking."
Scott Hammond: Let's do this thing, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. A- and, um,
and I, I had been at a, uh, Christmas party the month before and somebody said to me, he said, "What's the name of your company anyway?"
Scott Hammond: Hmm.
Patrick Cleary: "I mean, I know what you do, but-"
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: "… what's the name of the parent company?"
Communications."
Scott Hammond: Oh.
Patrick Cleary: And he says, "Oh, Lost Coast.
What a great brand that is."
Scott Hammond: Oh. [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: "I mean,
can't you see it? The moment somebody says Lost Coast,
Scott Hammond: You get a vision
Patrick Cleary: "… you can vi- you get a vision of it." He says,
here." And I'm like-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … "I have this brand that I don't use." I mean,
you know, we were KHUM, we were KSUG, we were The Point.
Scott Hammond: Right.
Patrick Cleary: You know, like we were very much not into branding
ourselves-
Scott Hammond: Uh-huh
Patrick Cleary: … as a corporate entity.
And so I said, "Okay, Hank, um, it has to be Lost Coast
something."
Scott Hammond: Hmm.
Patrick Cleary: You know?
And then around the second beer I was like, "How about the Lost Coast Outpost?"
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: You know, it kind of fits the, sort of the brand, like, you know,
edge of civilization there.
Scott Hammond: Right.
Patrick Cleary: The outpost, you know?
Scott Hammond: In the Yukon.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, exactly.
Scott Hammond: We're out here in the-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, at the-
Scott Hammond: … outpost
Patrick Cleary: … at the outpost. And Hank said, "Let me sleep on that."
Scott Hammond: Hmm.
Patrick Cleary: And he texts me back in the morning.
He says, "I can shorten it to Loco."
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: "I'm good."
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: "Let's do it."
Scott Hammond: It's got a colloquial name that everybody could remember.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. And, uh, a- and it is kind of fun, and so
we launched the Outpost in 2011.
Scott Hammond: So it's all organic. You guys invented this thing from ground
Patrick Cleary: I, I mean-
Scott Hammond: The URLs, the whole nine.
Patrick Cleary: So in fairness, Hank really has invented this thing.
Scott Hammond: Okay.
Patrick Cleary: Hank, Hank is the, um-Uh, you know, he's the genius behind
it. Um-
Scott Hammond: But you facilitated it. You-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, no, I-
Scott Hammond: You did the three. Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … absolutely. And, and Hank, you know,
and, you know-
Scott Hammond: Yeah [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: … he- or dealing with payroll or any of
Scott Hammond: Mr. List, uh, unless the writers-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, yeah. [laughs] Uh, uh, yeah, I talked to him, yeah,
and, um, you know, I was like, um, "You, you don't really wanna deal with this stuff, do you, Hank?" He's like, "No, I don't."
Scott Hammond: Yeah. All, all right.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Yeah. Well, a- and, but Hank's also a very ingenious,
uh, computer programmer.
Scott Hammond: Ah.
Patrick Cleary: So one of the things about The Outpost is Hank has created all these
little gadgets that can go to the sheriff's office every morning-
Scott Hammond: Oh
Patrick Cleary: … and say, "Who was arrested yesterday?"
Scott Hammond: And pull it live.
Patrick Cleary: And pull that information-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … post it automatically. I mean, that is automated.
Nobody has to do that.
Scott Hammond: There's no f- guy phoning in for the daily log in.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. No. A- and if you-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … if you dig into The Outpost,
quite appreciate about The Outpost is, um, you know, like, all the city agendas and-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … minutes.
Scott Hammond: Court dockets.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, court dockets.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um, you know, weather reports. I mean, like, um,
what's, what everybody else is printing.
Scott Hammond: Huh.
Patrick Cleary: You know, we have a whole section called Elsewhere-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … that will tell you what Kim Kemp has
Scott Hammond: I like that
Patrick Cleary: … the North Coast Journal has done.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, you know, there, there are many giz- you know, in fact,
if you go to the, um, the masthead and you look under it, I think it says News Gizmos.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and so Hank has all these gizmos that
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … the Outpost that are providing it with-
Scott Hammond: So it provides you guys as the core setter to start it,
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, and then, and then-
Scott Hammond: … go whatever
Patrick Cleary: … then, then we can add our contents to it-
Scott Hammond: Huh
Patrick Cleary: … over time, and, you know, and, you know, right now we've
got, um, I believe it's, uh, five reporters there, plus we have the, uh, Wild Rivers Outpost for Crescent City and Brookings.
Scott Hammond: Is there a correspondent up there or…?
Patrick Cleary: There, there, there is one correspondent up there as well.
Scott Hammond: Gotcha.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: So Hank had his background in Time-Standard, right?
Was he not an editor-
Patrick Cleary: He was the editor of-
Scott Hammond: … of the Daily?
Patrick Cleary: … the North Coast Journal.
Scott Hammond: Okay.
Patrick Cleary: He, he may have worked for the Time-Standard
Scott Hammond: I thought, I thought maybe or I, I could be wrong-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … but that's, that's true.
Patrick Cleary: I met him, the first time I met him, um, I was, um,
uh, I was one of the original members of the
Scott Hammond: Ah
Patrick Cleary: … board.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: And, um, Hank had just started as a reporter at
Journal.
Scott Hammond: Ah.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and I wasn't quite sure what, what to make of this guy. He reminded me a lot of the old, um, television character,
uh, Columbo.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: You know-
Scott Hammond: Peter Falk
Patrick Cleary: … he was a little bit, a little bit d- disheveled.
He had mus- uh, you know, a cigarette hanging out of his mouth,
Scott Hammond: Let me get this right.
Patrick Cleary: [laughs]
Scott Hammond: [laughs] The whole thing.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, Mr. Cleary, Mr. Cleary. Uh, you know, like-
Scott Hammond: [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: Um, and he did. He came up to me after the meeting
Cleary, I just have one question." You know, like, And then he asked a really hard question.
Scott Hammond: Of course.
Patrick Cleary: [laughs]
Scott Hammond: Legit.
Patrick Cleary: And I'm like, "Oh, this guy's smart." Um, you know,
and so that was kinda my first introduction to Hank.
Um, and so yeah, it's really, um, Hank has created something that is ex- you know, when you look at the changing media landscape and you look at-
Scott Hammond: Mm.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, you, you used to work for newspapers.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: Yeah, 20 years.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Um, that business has been
decimated-
Scott Hammond: Oh, boy
Patrick Cleary: … um, you know, by the internet.
Scott Hammond: Sure. Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and you know, you know, I, I don't know what the official circulation is of the Time-Standard at this point. Yeah. I, that's-
Scott Hammond: Yeah. Pretty, pretty low.
Patrick Cleary: That's what I hear.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: Maybe it's more on Sunday.
Patrick Cleary: Maybe. Yeah. I mean-
Scott Hammond: Love, love you guys at the Times. Love you,
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: But-
Patrick Cleary: Well, you know, John worked for us at Lost Coast for a
Scott Hammond: Oh, I did not know that.
Patrick Cleary: Oh, yeah.
Scott Hammond: How about that?
Patrick Cleary: John was, uh, the general manager there for three years.
Scott Hammond: I guess I do know that. Yeah, that's right.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, he was there for a little bit.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: They were 26,000 circulation on Sundays.
Patrick Cleary: Right? Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Geez, you know, we were,
the fre- we worked for the Tri- Tri Cities, you remember.
Patrick Cleary: Right, which was part of the-
Scott Hammond: You know, around Pellegi and, uh…
But, you know, we were 48,000 and we thought we were bad, badass and, with, they had their, their daily at 20,000 and now that would be enviable.
[laughs]
Patrick Cleary: Right? Yeah.
Scott Hammond: That'd be the envy of the nation.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: It's like-
Patrick Cleary: Well, a- and that, I was just gonna say, th-
I mean, that's nationwide is what-
Scott Hammond: It's not their fault.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: No.
Patrick Cleary: I mean, there, there were 300 newspapers
Scott Hammond: Yeah. Alone, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um, alone. Yeah.
Scott Hammond: And we had two at one time with that-
Patrick Cleary: Oh, yeah, with the Eureka Reporter.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: That was a, that was a-
Scott Hammond: So this-
Patrick Cleary: … golden era of, uh, Humboldt media, boy, I'll tell you.
Scott Hammond: I'll tell you, man, and it was a beautiful paper.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: I thought that it was gorgeous to look at.
My boss would come from Texas, he goes, "You have two daily papers in this back horse town?"
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Right?
Scott Hammond: I go, "How do you do this?"
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Well, they were, they were bleeding.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, both of them. Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Both of them, yeah. But, uh, but you know, we did get…
I was telling somebody the other day that, um, Western Web-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … you know, is a beautiful printing press-
Scott Hammond: Right
Patrick Cleary: … thanks to Rob Barkley and the Eureka Reporter.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um, but you know, I mean, the newspaper bus- you know, well, in
fact, the story I wanna tell is in 1997, the Wall Street Journal did an article on, uh, over-mediated markets.
Scott Hammond: Ah.
Patrick Cleary: And-
Scott Hammond: And we, we are one
Patrick Cleary: … Humboldt County was the most over-mediated,
uh, micropolitan area in the country.
Scott Hammond: How about that?
Patrick Cleary: More media outlets per capita than any place else in the country.
Scott Hammond: Totally believe it. Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: You know, 'cause we had all the TV stations,
Scott Hammond: Everywhere
Patrick Cleary: … the, you know, we have, uh, the Ferndale Enterprise, the,
Scott Hammond: 10 newspapers.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: I mean, Fortuna had its own newspaper.
Um, Arcata and McKinleyville were separate newspapers back then.
And-
Scott Hammond: Right.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Right.
Patrick Cleary: You know.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, the Beacon, what's his name, Odell owned-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, Patrick
Scott Hammond: … four or five papers.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, that's true. Competitive market.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: And we were… How do they, how would they research that?
I guess there's ways to gather that data.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, I mean, well, the FCC has central data, uh, base
for-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … television and radio, so that's easy.
Scott Hammond: So per capita, we had a lot of…
and-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … all that other s- happy horse stuff coming in.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Cable.
Cable was running strong-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … back then. Bill Smolin.
Patrick Cleary: Right.
Scott Hammond: William, William F. Smolin.
Patrick Cleary: Yes.
Scott Hammond: Did you ever meet him?
Patrick Cleary: No, I did not. I knew his, uh, his sister Carol Ann, his
brother, um, Don.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and I know, um, you know, the peop- the person
who runs the Smolin Foundation now.
Scott Hammond: Uh, he was legendary. Peabody Award winner.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.
Scott Hammond: One of the first West Coast TV stations, right? Channel 3.
Patrick Cleary: Yep.
Scott Hammond: KAM and, um, he sold the building one day.
He walked by my boss's office. He went, "Ron, you wanna buy the building?" He goes, "Yes, sir, Mr. Smolin, I'd like to." "Okay, I'll,
Good day,
Ron."
Patrick Cleary: [laughs]
Scott Hammond: And that's how it was done. It wasn't even a handshake.
It was-
Patrick Cleary: [laughs]
Scott Hammond: … high five.
There's no five.
Patrick Cleary: [laughs]
Scott Hammond: Call me. Uh, and now he owns half of a city block-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … in Eureka, so yeah, the guy was legendary, and he was,
Cronkite won the Peabody, so he's, he's in that-
Patrick Cleary: Right
Scott Hammond: … that realm. He was, I guess he was a terrific guy, but he
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. So, so LoCo's become the monster in terms of,
in a best sense of the word, popular, read, hit. I mean, it's-
Patrick Cleary: Well, it-
Scott Hammond: It, it's bigger than, say, the Time-Standard or the Journal on an
online present. It's bigger than anything.
Patrick Cleary: Oh, yeah.
Scott Hammond: The County.
Patrick Cleary: I mean, you know, I mean, I'll put my s-
uh, statistics up against, you know, any… I mean, it's bigger than-
Scott Hammond: Anything North State even. I, I don't know.
Patrick Cleary: I, you know, I, I haven't looked at the numbers lately,
looked, I think we were bigger than the Press Democrat in
Scott Hammond: Wouldn't surprise me.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and you know, we actually, uh, last year,
there's, um, an organization, a nationwide organization called the, uh, I think it's the League of Independent Online Newspapers.
Scott Hammond: Mm.
Patrick Cleary: LION.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: And, uh, they said, uh, "Would you like us to come in and do an
audit of the Lost Coast Outpost?" And I was like, "Yes, please."
Scott Hammond: Sure.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, I'm like, "You know, come in and tell us what we could be doing
Scott Hammond: Come on down.
Patrick Cleary: And, you know, and so they, they spent some time with us
wrote a report, and they said, um, "You guys are the poster child for how to do local news right."
Scott Hammond: Wow.
Patrick Cleary: And I was like, "So what could we do better?"
Scott Hammond: How about that? Huh.
Patrick Cleary: Well, I was kinda disappointed, to be honest.
Scott Hammond: Get an A plus.
Patrick Cleary: Like, you know, like, come on.
Scott Hammond: Get an A, man.
Patrick Cleary: Like, tell me something I can work on.
Like, you know, like-
Scott Hammond: Something
Patrick Cleary: … you know, like we can't possibly be that good.
I mean-
Scott Hammond: Moved to Eureka.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Oh, you did.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, yeah. Well, w- w… Yeah, we did.
Scott Hammond: Yeah. Combine, combine with the radio stations.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. But you know, I mean, the interesting thing about Lost Coast too
uh, KHUM has won an Edward R. Mur- Murrow Award for best, uh, radio documentary. It won a National Association of Broadcasters award for the storm coverage back in
2005. Um-
Scott Hammond: Wow
Patrick Cleary: … KSLG has won a Radio Mercury award for
announcements. I mean w-
Scott Hammond: Mm
Patrick Cleary: … you know, the, the people there are incredibly talented.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and you know, and again, you know, like we're
in market size 272 maybe out of 300 or something like that in the United States.
Scott Hammond: You're really at the bot-
Patrick Cleary: I mean-
Scott Hammond: Top, top 10, lower per- 10%, right?
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. I mean, we- we're, we're,
you know, we shouldn't be doing this well.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Like, you know, they're b- the rest of the country should be doing
you know? It's-
Scott Hammond: That's a good way to look at it.
the o- obits.
Patrick Cleary: Yes.
Scott Hammond: The, the, I don't know how he draws
the data, but no one has an obit like Hank does. He does it… And so I'm sure some are submitted and-
Patrick Cleary: Almost, almost all of them are submitted.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Really classy.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: I mean, done, done well.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, no, I mean, that was actually something that, um,
you know, we kinda got into it as a, on a fluke, but a,
a friend-
Scott Hammond: Mm
Patrick Cleary: … of mine's father had died, and she said,
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … so I asked Hank, and Hank said, "Well, we just…
You know, I don't wanna just do one-offs. I wanna have, like, a policy." And-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … and so we came up with a, you know, "Well, why
don't we just do it for free?" Um, and, um, and you know, Hank's criteria is you have to have lived in Humboldt County or have a memorial service in Humboldt County, so we're not getting people from T-
Scott Hammond: Sure
Patrick Cleary: … Texas sending their obits.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, that's fair.
Patrick Cleary: You know? Um, keep it lo- you know, relevant locally.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: But, uh, after the booked section, it's the
second most read section of-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … of the Outpost.
Scott Hammond: So the jail, the, the- [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: Who, who got, who got arrested last night
Scott Hammond: So he draws that… He, that's fresh hot bread every morning.
Patrick Cleary: Yep.
Scott Hammond: Huh. Makes sense. I mean, that's, that sells.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Well, yeah, p- people are always curious.
Scott Hammond: Time-Standard, the DUIs was a huge deal, man, when they published-
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … the… They went back and forth.
They would publish, then not publish-
Patrick Cleary: Mm-hmm
Scott Hammond: … and then they'd put them back and… So,
So you, you became, uh, a dir- uh, president or eight of, of the, uh, uh, um, Humboldt Area Foundation?
Patrick Cleary: Uh, executive director of the Humboldt Area
There's actually a couple small things in between.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Or during, simultaneous.
Scott Hammond: Oh, please, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: So they, um, I was actually the interim general manager
KHSU-
Scott Hammond: Oh
Patrick Cleary: … uh, from 2008 to 2010.
Scott Hammond: Wow.
Patrick Cleary: Um, I'm pretty sure I was, at that time, the
only person in the United States who simultaneously ran an NPR station and-
Scott Hammond: [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: … three, three commercial radio stations.
Scott Hammond: That's pretty cool.
Patrick Cleary: It, it was pretty cool. Um, and-
Scott Hammond: Yeah, you pulled it off, yeah
Patrick Cleary: … but, uh, you know, KHSU was having some challenges at
Scott Hammond: Sure.
Patrick Cleary: They had fired their general manager, and so I went in just to try to
steady the ship a little bit.
Scott Hammond: Will they, will they be back? I know m- they, they're gone.
They t- what's his name?
Patrick Cleary: Disassembled it several years ago, right?
The university, yeah, basically outsourced it to, um, Capital Public Radio. Mm-hmm. Um, they have,
um, one or two people lo- you know, who produce a little bit of- Mm-hmm … local programming, but it will never be what it was. So just like the Lumberjack football team's not coming back. Yeah. Yeah. So- No, I don't think so. I would think it'd be easier to resurrect than- Well, they still ha- they still own the station. Yeah. I guess it's a money thing. Yeah, I think it… Um, and, you know, I, I mean, what Tom Jackson said when he came, you know, is that,
um, and, uh, to some degree, th- you know, there weren't a whole lot of students involved in KHSU. It was a local endeavor in every way. It w- Um, yeah. I mean, I, I… To me, uh, and I argued this, um, quite a bit with, um, Ron Richmond at the time when he "It is your best way of letting people know what's going on at the university." yeah. And, and I said, "You don't do a very good job of that." Um, I- No … I said, "There's a lot of things happening on the and you've got 30,000 people listening to you every week. You could be telling them, 'Hey, we got this, you know, classical concert. We got this, you know- Sure … uh, guest lecturer. We've got this- you know, we've got this sporting event." Yeah. "You know, we've got all this stuff." Um, they didn't do a very good job of that. Yeah. Um, we started to get there. And then I did a, a brief foray into politics in 2010 and ran for county supervisor. I kind of remember that. Yeah, You might have. How did that go for you? You know, um- [laughs] Close but no cigar. Yeah. Learning experience. Learning experience, right. Who'd you run against? Well, the way I like to look at it, uh, Joe Duffy was retiring. Uh-huh. I declared, and then a fellow named Ryan Sundberg me. Gotcha. So. Gotcha. Uh, and I got 49.3% of the vote. Gee whiz. That's a pretty good, pretty good run. Not bad for a guy from New York City. Yeah, just ki- [laughs] The, the walk-on that came on the football field. Yeah. That's pretty good.
But, um, but having not succeeded in that endeavor,
um, you know, as my wife and I talk about, was a blessing in disguise because- Probably, yeah … um, a year and a half later, the, um, position of executive director of Humboldt Area Foundation opened up. Right. Right. And had I just been elected supervisor- Couldn't do that … I couldn't- Yeah … you know, just bail from that. Can't do both. Yeah. No, and it would've looked, you know, awful. Yeah. So, um, so I did get hired, um, as the, uh, executive director of the foundation and- What does the foundation do? J- explain r- real quick what- So it- How much do they man… They manage a lot of money. Yeah, I mean, but so Humboldt Area Foundation is like what they call a community foundation. Mm-hmm. Which is basically, think of it as a, uh, amalgamation of a lot of small foundations. Mm-hmm. Um, you know, in order to effectively create a foundation and have the infrastructure to, uh, invest and, you know… A- and a foundation, what they do is they take the money, they invest it, and they pay the earnings out, um, you know, to do good work. I see.
Um, but, um, in order to… A- and, and they can do it forever that way, with that model. Right. Um, they contin- you know, you, you tend not to touch the original investment amount, but you, the- So the principal remains. Yeah. So, like, when I was there, I think w- you know, we had,
um, we had given out more than we'd ever, you know, been given. Sure. Uh, and we still had… And we had a lot more money than we started. The miracle of compound interest. Yes, exactly. So, so how– Without digging too deep in- Yeah … who, who determines the investments? Is- Do they have internal investors, or do they farm that out to- Well, um- … whome- whomever? We, um, the investment committee of the board made decisions or, you know, final recommendations- Mm-hmm … But we had a, uh, at, at the time an advisor out of Los Angeles-
Mm
… um, who was very, very good. Hmm. Um, and I had been… You know, part of my, um, uh, why I was re- even remotely qualified for this job been– I had sat on the investment committee- and the audit committee at the foundation for a number of years before that. Mm-hmm. So I, I actually understood that part of it pretty well. Sure.
Um, you know, so there, there, there was that part of it, but then there's the, you know, the much harder part of how do you give Right. Um- To whom and where and- Yeah. Yeah. A- a- and, and obviously, you know, it, you know, the challenges that face our community are,
you know,
um, I don't know that there's an amount of money that can solve that problem. I don't think that yeah [laughs] Um- We don't have that much on hand. But, you know, what, uh, the, one of the examples that I've, um, used of where the foundation could be really helpful is, um,
if you, um, drive into Arcata off of Samoa Boulevard, and there's that building on the, um, left that has the marble mur- muralettes painted on them. Mm-hmm. And it's, uh, um, uh, Hu- It was a Humboldt Housing Corporation that put up, uh, uh, built a building there basically, uh, for, um, people who needed permanent supportive housing. Mm-hmm. Uh, Humboldt Area Foundation gave the original
… that allowed them to prepare the, um, the plans- Mm-hmm … for it, after which they were able to seek, you know, other f- outside funding. Wow. Um, and, you know, so that was an example of an effective use of Mm-hmm … uh, where we could make smaller grantsTo, um, really, um, jumpstart certain activities Sure Um, the foundation also does a lot of college scholarships. Mm-hmm. Uh, they give out close to a million dollars a college- Wow … scholarships. Um, they do a lot of work
around, um, you know, um, the arts, um, around, um, community- Mm … energy. Um, and then, you know, as the times changed, you know, we started to, um, really, you know, g- start the community conversation around equity and- Mm … um, and some of the disparities in our community. So how many years were you at the pr- at the helm? Um, I was executive director for seven years, uh, from 2012 to 2019, and then I stepped down for, uh, two years and just ran the investment and did some of the work with donors and things like that. Wow. Um, and then I, you know, retired from there,
uh, during the pandemic. But not quite retired with Humboldt Fest. Well, the- that, yeah. The, the- Or did we miss something? Was there- No, no, no, no, no- Okay. I don't wanna miss anything … uh, uh, uh, well, um- It's a big resume, folks. Wow. [laughs] Yeah. Yeah. So Folklife, you've been at the helm of
Well, um, so
in 2001,
um, before I got re-engaged in the work world, um, I went off to a music camp- [laughs] … um, to, uh, you know, learn how to play the guitar. Found out I was doing it all wrong.
Um,
and, um, came back and was very… got very passionate about music education. And I- a- at that time, I'd actually been starting a conversation with people here about, we were talking, you know, economic development and things like that. Mm-hmm. And I still maintain, and I still may, this may still happen at some point, that, um, one of the best economic development strategies we could have in Humboldt County would be to have another university. Oh, oh. Uh, because universities bring, um, you know, they bring brains, they bring, uh- Everything. [clears throat] … y- you know, a, a lot of, um- Mm-hmm … thoughtfulness, um, and culture and- So maybe a private university- Yeah … smaller scale. Yeah. A- and maybe a music university. Oh. Uh, or a music and arts. Arts, yeah. Yeah. Um, and wouldn't we be- Huh … a good place to do that? Wouldn't that be the perfect… Yeah. Yeah.
And, um, and so I, I wrote a very, um, passionate letter to the board of the Humboldt Folklife Society, uh, which I just found. [laughs] I hadn't read it in 20 years.
[laughs] So I thought, um, uh, I, I was, um,
very, um, forward at that point in time [laughs] about some of my ideas. I, but I, I was like, "Hey, Humboldt Folklife Society, you've been around…" At that point, f- they were around for 20 years. So, I mean, w- w- They've been around a while, yeah. Yeah. I mean, and I was like, "You could be a great vehicle for creating a, uh, a music, a folk music university," which I- Huh … I would, uh, shorten to Folk U from ti- Folk U … uh, from time to time. Wait a minute. [laughs] Hey, listen. Did you catch that, Nick? [laughs] Yeah. Um- Folk, Folk U.
[laughs] Anyway, sorry. Um, th, th… Uh- I love it. Yeah.
Um, and so I got a, you know… A- and the board kind of said, "Who the hell is this guy?" Yeah. Um, "We've never seen you move-" This young, guy … move no chairs at the festival and- So, um, so I- Yeah … got involved, um, and, uh, helped to put on the 2002 Folklife Festival. Huh. Um, and then got really involved in that and kind of expanded it. Mm-hmm. It used to be, um, kind of a three-day thing. Was it up at the Lazy J or, uh- Lazy L … Lazy L, Foot Hill? Um, it, it, it left, uh, Lazy L stopped in the '90s before I got here. Mm-hmm. Uh, the, uh, property had sold, but that's where the festival was for- you know, a long, long time. Uh- Is that Craig, Craig, uh, the volt- the repairman? He, he's the… Glenn Campbell. Oh, Gl- uh, yeah, uh, Craig- Was that his- … Craig Lemaster's family. That was his daddy, yeah. Yeah, right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Craig's a great guy. [laughs] Yeah. Yeah, he's quite a musician. Oh, he loves Glenn, He, he played with his daughter, I guess. Yes, he- Right … yeah, he still does. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Fuck, he's a nice man. He is. So 20… So th- you've been doing this 20, I'm counting 22- Way too long … Way too long. Yeah. Yeah. Um- Wow … you know, um, I'm, I keep trying to take a step back every year and- Describe it real quick so the, Folklife Festi- uh, so the Humboldt Folklife Society is a very tiny nonprofit- Uh-huh … that, um, believes that everybody should, um, participate in music and dance. Mm-hmm. And whether that's playing an instrument- [clears throat] … whether it's dancing, whether it's singing- Mm-hmm … uh, whether it's enjoying the live show. Yeah. Um, so, um, you know, we, we've put on, you know, the Folklife Festival since the very beginning- Mm-hmm … since 1978 or whatever. Wow. Um, we've done a lot of dances over the years- Mm-hmm
… um, o- of various types. Uh, we have produced our own shows. We don't really do that as much anymore. Mm-hmm.
Um, we do some education. We're doing a major push right now to do a lot more education. Wow. Um, we traditionally have done workshops at the Fe- Folklife Festival. Mm-hmm. So if you wanted- Which is AugustUh, July
Scott Hammond: July
Patrick Cleary: July
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: Um,
you know, so if you wanted to bring your mandolin-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … and, you know, take some lessons
Scott Hammond: I gotta, I gotta take some lessons, I think.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Well, you know, I mean, we all do.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: I mean, it's like i- i-
you know, eh, the, the, the funny thing is, like, you know-
Scott Hammond: You play mandolin, don't you?
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, among other instruments, yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Um, but, you know, there's, there's this, like, misconception that, oh, some people are so talented.
Scott Hammond: [laughs] They practice a lot.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. That's what it is.
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: It's like, like, you know, nobody…
You know, very few people are, like, just naturally talented and can pick up an instrument. All-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … most of us-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … need to, you know, watch somebody else do it,
you know-
Scott Hammond: And people that got discovered, like Jimi Hendrix,
Patrick Cleary: Absolutely
Scott Hammond: … for years.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: You know, it's like these guys kill themselves.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: Couple are overnight.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Like Taylor Swift. No, I'm kidding.
Patrick Cleary: No, [laughs] you're right.
Scott Hammond: Just kidding out there.
Patrick Cleary: No, she … Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, no, she was not overnight.
Patrick Cleary: Not-
Scott Hammond: She worked really hard
Patrick Cleary: … far from it. Far from it.
Scott Hammond: She's worked very hard.
Patrick Cleary: Yes. Um, and then, you know, people like Molly Tuttle-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … whose dad is probably the leading instructor
of, uh, folk music down in the Bay Area.
Scott Hammond: How about that? Okay.
Patrick Cleary: So she grew up in a musical family.
Scott Hammond: I'm gonna get tickets.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Yeah.
Scott Hammond: They go on sale the 29th. What is today?
How many-
Patrick Cleary: I think it's Monday
Scott Hammond: … weeks? Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, let's do that.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, with the infamous Stringdusters, no less.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, that should be good.
Patrick Cleary: That should be a good show.
Scott Hammond: So the, the, the Folklife Fest coming up at Dell Art
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … Blue Lake, California.
Patrick Cleary: Um, that, that we're plan- we're starting to, uh,
mid-July. You know, uh, the week ending July.
Scott Hammond: Can't resist.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, you point to-
Scott Hammond: Jo-
Patrick Cleary: Go ahead
Scott Hammond: … Joni, I'm looking at the, the map.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: It's right here, Blue Lake.
Patrick Cleary: Point to the map, yeah.
Scott Hammond: Right here by Korbel.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. [laughs]
Scott Hammond: Yeah, Blue Lake. You know, it seems like the Dell Art-
Patrick Cleary: Dell Arte
Scott Hammond: … Dell Arte would be perfect
for a, uh, folk univ- Folk U.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, we're-
Scott Hammond: It would
Patrick Cleary: … we're, we're, we're exploring that possibility with
You know, Dell Arte is going through, um, a metamorphosis at this point.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: You know, the, uh, original generation of the, um-
Scott Hammond: Carlo and, wow, what a history
Patrick Cleary: … yeah, a- a- and, you know, Joan and, Joan Shirley and Donald Forrest-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … have passed away recently.
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: Michael Fields, who's no longer involved.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: Uh, so they have a new leadership there.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um,
and yeah, we did a folk school there last year
successful.
Scott Hammond: Mm.
Patrick Cleary: I was pretty happy with it.
Um, you know, where we taught, you know, bluegrass guitar or harmony singing or-
Scott Hammond: Nice
Patrick Cleary: … um-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … there was a, uh, I don't know if you know…
Uh-
Scott Hammond: Just saw him t- uh, Friday night in Trinidad.
Patrick Cleary: Okay, yeah.
Scott Hammond: What a nice man.
Patrick Cleary: Yes, he's a, and a brilliant musician.
Scott Hammond: What a great… I mean, he's playing the fiddle, and i- it's, uh,
jazz horns.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: I'm go- [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: Yeah
Scott Hammond: … I go, "This guy's, he's off the hook."
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, so R- R- you know, Rob, uh, emailed me right before the folk
school last year and said, "Hey, I'd love to be involved." And I was like, Rob. Like, you wanna teach a couple classes?" I said. And he said, "Yeah, I'd love to." And I said, "Whatever you wanna teach,
Scott Hammond: What a resource.
Patrick Cleary: And so he emails me and says, "I'd like to teach East Indian ragas
on the violin."
Scott Hammond: [laughs] Okay, perfect.
Patrick Cleary: I had my doubts, but-
Scott Hammond: Yeah
Patrick Cleary: … uh, but it w- it was a well-attended workshop.
Scott Hammond: Gotta take him to the double A.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. [laughs]
Scott Hammond: Talk to him.
Patrick Cleary: Um, yeah, I mean, we have such tremendous talent
here-
Scott Hammond: Oh my gosh
Patrick Cleary: … in Humboldt County. Um-
Scott Hammond: It's a whole nother podcast, yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, it is.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: I mean, you know, to some extent, you
ago.
Scott Hammond: Yeah, but there's some guy like Rob, you know,
Patrick Cleary: Yeah.
Scott Hammond: So as, as we wrap up, what, uh, a couple questions.
Patrick Cleary: At this point, um, you know, I, I'm gonna try to, um,
oh, you know, uh, help Lost Coast get moved into, um-
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm
Patrick Cleary: … uh, its new facility, um, get the, um,
transfer to the Blue Lake Rancheria-
Scott Hammond: Sure
Patrick Cleary: … the ownership. Um, you know, stay involved to,
you know, as a advisor if desired.
Scott Hammond: Sure.
Patrick Cleary: Um, but I really wanna focus on my music.
Scott Hammond: Mm-hmm.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: Hmm
Patrick Cleary: … you know, as I think I said before we started, I,
record some of my original stuff finally, 'cause I've been writing songs for 20, 30 years.
Scott Hammond: Bongo Boy Studios, Jimmy Foote.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, yeah.
Scott Hammond: Yep.
Patrick Cleary: And Dominic Romano.
Scott Hammond: And Roman- I've heard that's a really quality studio
Patrick Cleary: It is.
Scott Hammond: It's, it's everything that a musician would love.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah, and Dominic is a, a very good producer.
Scott Hammond: Oh.
Patrick Cleary: Um, and, you know, I have been… You know, I finally
just said to him, I said, "Look, I'm scared to death of this."
Scott Hammond: Mm.
Patrick Cleary: You know, "Help me."
Scott Hammond: Ah. [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: You know, like, you know, "I hate the sound of my voice."
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: Who doesn't?
Patrick Cleary: Right?
Scott Hammond: [laughs]
Patrick Cleary: Um, so I'm doing that. Um, we have a couple bands.
Uh, my wife and I are in, um, both the, uh, Backseat Drivers, which is sort of an acoustic blues band, band called All Wheel Drive that's more of a swing jazz
band.
Scott Hammond: Nice.
Patrick Cleary: Um-
Scott Hammond: Hi, Kat.
Patrick Cleary: Yeah. Hi, Kat.
Scott Hammond: Yeah.
Patrick Cleary: Uh, and then Kat and I do, um, a duo thing.
Uh, we'll be playing, um, Easter at-
Scott Hammond: Mm
Patrick Cleary: … Moonstone Crossing Winery-
Scott Hammond: Very nice
Patrick Cleary: … Easter Sunday.
Scott Hammond: Hey, thanks for coming. Appreciate you, Patrick.
Patrick Cleary: All right. Thank you, Scott.
Scott Hammond: Thank you.